It's good to realise that many people are still keeping an open mind about the case. Every day I come across young people who have discovered sites such as this one and now want the Cobain Case to be re-opened.
Websites are still being set up. At www.marchonseattle.com, a mass protest is being prepared for the future so that the case may be brought to the public eye in an attempt to have it re-opened. What was reassuring to learn about the march is that they intend to gather both people who do't belive the murder claims and those who do.
On Justiceforkurt.com, I recently came across two rebuttal theories on the murder argument. They were logical and well put together. IT just made me even more confused. I was wondering if anyone would give me a second opinion on the arguments they make?
It's at http://www.justiceforkurt.com/investigation/rebuttals.shtml
--Chris
<mailto:mutantculture@yahoo.com>

Thanks for blogging here Chris. One thing I do know is that I've been talking with people since 1997 and still nothing solid has been done. I hope, as the others do, that something will eventually be brought to the surface along side Grant's investigation that will make more sense. I can admit Im still confused about it but I trust Grant totally in this issue. This guy knows what hes talking about even though hes talking very little. Unfortunately, we have to definitley keep searching for truth in anything to add to the 'week gap' that Kurt went missing until the day he was found dead. I've been to Justice for Kurt, its a great site and it led to a lot of others to do the same. Keep up the faith. It took about 20 years for Michael Skakel to go to prison for the death of Martha Moxley.
--C. Acierno

Hmm, interesting.

Always pondered this scenario, but Courtney seems so normal to me.
--Henry

With all due respect for your opinion..sincerely..Courtney seems far from 'normal' to me. I'm not saying she was involved or wasn't. So much of her behaviour after this beautiful soul left us seemed terribly self centered..narcissitic..and attention seeking. It struck me as pretensious and acted. Then again..people cope with loss in so many ways..who knows?? I do know that I often still think of Kurt Cobain and what a gentle human being he surely was. I agree that the truth will reveal itsself in time. I hope I'm around to see it. This was IMHO a guy who was incapble of harm a flea.

With all that I have read from over the years, with all the contradictions and lies that Courtney told Grant leading upto and after Kurt's body was found, plus all the real evidence, not to mention the slack/complacent attitude of the Police who really did a crap job on this, should all bring us to the conclusion that Kurt's death was extremely ambigious. Therefore for all the confusion a case should be opened. Why this has happened yet is bizzare and suspect. If Courtney was really innocent why wouldn't she want to clear her name and get to the bottom of her husband's death? It's all to fishy. If you hear the taped messages by both C.Love and Rosemary Carroll it all makes sense. Grant was basically hired to make it look like she cared but sent him on wild goose chases, lieing to him and giving him wrong information while she was running around behind his back maybe plotting Kurt's demise. And we all know why.

One thing I noticed in the Kurt & Courtney film was what Dylan Carlson said. He basically told Nick Broomfield that he DIDN'T think that Kurt was at all suicidal 'if he was suicidal why didn't he use the gun that day - why did he go to Exodus? So hints that he could have been murdered. Then when Broomfield asks whether he thinks he was murdered he also dismisses this and asks 'why?'. Well if he didn't think he was suicidal or murdered what exactly does Dylan think happened? He does'nt say and comes across like he's being integrigated, like he's hiding something. He later spats in the same interview '... if I really thought Kurt was murdered, the people who did it or if Courtney was involved I'd kill them flat out.' ummmmmmm

Dylan was asked by C.Love to check the greenhouse prior to Kurt's body being found but he failed to do this or mention to Grant about the greehouse. When both Carlson and Grant heard on the radio about Kurt, Grant gushed 'why did'nt you tell me about the greenhouse' to which Carlson said 'it's just a little dirty room' (the exact same words Cali - the nanny - used to describe the greehouse afterwards). Even more strange is that when Carlson was interviewed in May of 1994 he told a journalist he knew NOTHING about a greehouse and didn't know it existed. This all smells really fishy indeed. There's also about 15 other things/points that don't add up here but the fact that no-one in the authorities is taking all this seriously is so tragic. You gotta ask yourself why would T.Grant put his life on the line if he did'nt think what he says? Which is I quote from his own website; 'after several months on this case I have concluded that both Courtney and Cali were involved in some sort of conspiracy in Kurt's death'. By the way it's also revealed in the book Heavie Than Heaven that the person who was trying to use Cobain's credit card was Cali. The book claims Kurt gave it to him but he could've found it after seeing Kurt dead as the card was used between the dates 4th to 8th of April 1994 when Kurt was missing.
Lastly, both T.Grant and Rosermary Carroll suspected that the note from Cali left on the stairs of the Lake Washington house to tell Kurt to phone Courtney looked 'phony' and looked as though it was staged. They both claim he could've written it after seeing him dead. Or KNOWING he was dead.

It's got to be the biggest rock'n'roll swindle of all.

Yeah it also states in the Heavier Than Heaven book(page 334) that on Monday 4th April 1994;

'...Cali left the Cobain house for the evening leaving Jessica (his girlfriend) alone in his room. Around midnight she heard noises; 'They were walking with a purpose'..... Cali didn't return until after 3am...'

Being 3am this was now the 5th Apr, the date thought to be when Kurt died. Now call me crazy but I wonder what Cali was doing during the night. I suspect, what with instructions from Courtney via the phone about leaving a fake note to Kurt to mislead T.Grant and co, that Cali might've been with Kurt in the greehouse, assisted Kurt with the heroin and then once Kurt was out cold from the drug either then alerted the murderer to come or even did it himself. He could've then quickly wiped the finger prints of the gun AND pen left, layed out all the things that were found on the scene including the forged so-called suicide note that was given to him by C.Love (that she kept from Rome then added the bottom four lines) and hey presto. All sounds very profound yes, but Cali couldn't wait to get out of Seattle after the 5th and Courtney did her very best to protect Cali from T.Grant, who has probably come to the same conclusion.

That book also claims that Cali on the 7th April Cali drove with two fiends back to Seattle after Courtney told him to have another look for Kurt. However the truth is - in the Police report - Cali flew to L.A that afternoon and stayed there until he found out about Kurt's death on the 8th. Which makes perfect sense. How on Earth would someone been able to fly to L.A in the afternoon and manage to 'drive' all the way back up to Seattle by 'dusk' which the book states. Strange eh?.

There's too many things that don't add up here.

Interesting what Courtney had to say about Kurt in the NME this week. She claims Kurt was an 'alpha male', that he was 'materalistic', that if Kurt were still alive 'we'd be taking private jets. Kurt would've loved that', that he was, wait for it, a 'red-blooded American capitalist.' Does this really sound like the Kurt Cobain we knew, who would rather take a van everywhere than a limo? I thought she was supposed to be his wife.

More interestingly she says that 'When I entered into their (Nirvana) world it was all very happy.' Yeah and looked what happened after that. And talks of writting a song called '20 Years of Dakota', where Lennon was shot. Oh the irony.

She then admits 'I first met Kurt in 1988, and by the time Nevermind came out we were in a relationship....he was paronoid but it took a long time to get him to my way of thinking.' Wonder what she means there eh?

In the interview she just would'nt give an answer as to what she thought the standout track on Nevermind as most of the songs were not about her (me me me me me) and then claimed to write lyrics on In Utero, in an attempt to say look I'm talented too. More tellingly she lets slip that she only bothered to go to the MTV awards with Kurt to show a family united front and that 'it'll be in the LA Times and then the social workers would leave us alone' since Frances was taken away. Talk about have it all sussed out.

Lastly, at the mo, she claims that along with depression it was his undiagnosed stomach complaint that 'killed him ultimately'. However by the end of 1993 his stomach disorder had cured itself and by the spring of 1994, with a young daughter in his life, he was said to be 'the happiest I've ever been.'

Courtney should just shut up about Kurt as nearly everything she says doesn't do her any favours. I REALLY hope she had nothing to do with it but going by the evidence, and what her own friends and her own father have said about her, plus the stupid remarks she makes about Kurt and the actual circumstances at the time of his death makes it almost obvious. Too obvious.

What pisses me off is that Kurt should be known for being a brilliant unique modern rock star. A one off who's music, lyrics and artwork were all the work of genius not to mention his fashion sense, sense of humour unpretentiousness were all a bonus. Instead he is seen as some kind of loser who took the easy way out and yet with all the evidence at this stage NOTHING has been done to prove he was murdered. Yes he was a junkie but even if he was suicidal he just could not have picked up that gun, someone else did it. How could a dead person wipe their own fingerprints off? How could a guy with all the heroin tidy up by putting the syringe and arm belt back in the box then pick up a gun? It's laughable. I also have seen a photo of a piece of paper of Courtney wrote on about her new band and it IS the exact same writing that's on the bottom of his so-called suicide note.

How long do we have to wait to get some kind of justice for Cobain. It makes me so angry that Kurt's own family, even the media and the millions of fans have all been had, duped, coned and lied to for too long. Tom Grant, god bless you, get your act together and stop sitting on the fence with all your evidence and do even more! Something has got to be done. Here in the UK Kurt is all over the press/magazines again because it's the 15th anniversary of Nevermind but instead of celebrating with Dave and Krist, and us, he's dead. It's fucking wrong.
--D.Thomas

I've just been on that website the first dude, Chris, name-dropped 'marchonseattle.com' and have come across some fascinating stuff. It's so recent as it's fresh news. If you go on the sites on myspace there's guy, who I won't name (oh well ok... Lance) and he's an old friend of the friend of Cali', the Cobain nanny. After letting him know this guy was ok and to be trusted from the mutual friend, Cali contacted Lance and revealed tons of info. Amongst loads of other stuff he hinted that Eric Erlandson was probably the one who killed Kurt, but it was all set up by Geffen as he had been 'fucked over' by Kurt as Kurt wanted out of Nirvana so would lose him a ton of cash, not to mention he hated Kurt, this Cali states. In the emails he also links Eric with Kirsten' death but stresses he thinks Courtney was innocent. He also told this Lance that even though he thought Dylan did'nt have anything to do with Kurt's death Dylan put two and two together when he found out he was shot by that particular gun as he only told Courtney after Kurt went missing, but as she was in L.A it could've been Eric NOT Courtney.

However Hank Harrison, who is also a member of this sites myspace and is the real Hank BTW, replied after seeing this and wrote back. This is what he had to say only last month, 18 Aug:

'I know for a fact she (Courtney) did it. She had advisors, she did have a lot of help. Mainly from William who crushes cucurbita moschata. .... Here's another thing you may not know, check out who was giving concerts where the week Kurt died and check out who kept calling the house around Christmas after the tour was cancelled and who Kurt told to piss off and who was in London with the baby en route to Spain when the Rome incident took place. Then see if he or she had henchman, any involvement with smack and who had somebody die in his own band too.'

He of course is describing.... William 'Billy' Corgan.

Hank also points out she confesses in 'Doll Parts' but I can't hear it. Can anyone else? Does he mean the song or is there a book I'm not aware of?

He then states that when Courtney put out Kurt's diaries the paperback contained a recipe, bizzarely written by herself, for chocolate cookies, it's printed in red ink and he claims is the biggest clue, I quote;

'A connection you should all see'.

He of course means Kurt's so-called suicide note. It too was written in red ink and as the person above me says the writing looks just like hers.

Lastly, even though Hank replied to those emails he reckoned the person claiming to be Cali was a poser but when you read it it looks for real. Why would anyone bother to pose as him - especially as the emails are pages long -as the only person he doesn't accuse out right is Cali. He dosn't say she did'nt do it (so it's not Courtney posing as him). And when you read his comments they add up and he's never caught out.

I've looked up where Corgan was the week Cobain went missing and he was in the Mid-West that entire week so I don't know what H.Williams was getting at. While I'm here can I point out that when Hank says Courtney confesses in 'Doll Part's' he meant she had it all planned out and was being cryptic as Hole recorded Live Thru This before he died. But when you hear some of the lyrics it doesn't surprise me. Just listen to the likes of Violet and Jennifer's Body..... 'He cuts you down from the tree, he keeps you in a box... I'm your lover I'm your friend... with a bullet number one, kill the family save the son ... HIMSELF.' Maybe I'm clutches at straws here and taking this too far but that could be about Kurts envitable demise. You know the bits about the tree and box could be connotations/euphemisms for the greenhouse and the rest is well obvious.

There's even more clues on Celebrity skin.

i dont get it if he took heroin then how did he shoot him self he would have been to wasted to put the gun in his mouth.
--dani
<mailto:danielle_tlbt@yahoo.co.uk>

i found these when i was looking at a web site.
Cobain allegedly injected himself with three times the lethal dose of heroin--making it nearly impossible for him to be able to shoot himself.
Cobain's head wounds are not consistent with other suicide victims' self-inflicted wounds, meaning someone else pulled the trigger.
His suicide note wasn't a suicide note. Some Cobain was telling fans he was "retiring" from rock 'n' roll and that the suicidal bits were forged later.
There are no fingerprints on the shotgun, which wasn't thoroughly examined until a month later
--dani

Yeah it all adds up because none of it adds up if you get what I'm saying. There are too many facts pointing to murder than suicide so purely on that basis a case for a closure on the subject should be opened. Surley if C.Love was innocent she would want to clear her name for Frances sake and anyway would'nt she want to know exactly what happened to her husband instead of doing all she can to prevent it a new case happening? People say that if she were innocent why would she want to go through a court case and drag up all the past again but I say Courtney could cope with anything if it really mattered to her. Get my drift?

It's very interesting.
I think that case should reopen cause you have very good facts.But who was using his credit card after his death!?. I don't get it.

Kurt commited sucide. period.
"look on the brightside sucide" he sang

yea, I agree with the guy above me, Kurt did shoot himself. He always mentioned suicide in his lyrics. "Look on the brightside suicide, the darkside, I'm on yourside" he sang in the song Milk it of In Utero.

No,the actual lyrics are:"Look on the bright side is suicide,lost eyesight i'm on your side."I think he was saying something more positive,like,maybe if you only see the brightside,you're in for a rude awakening,and then may "suicide."That's my interpretation anyway.
--anonymous

Suicidio......

I find it highly suspicious that Love avoids the murder theory, and tried to stop the Kurt & Courtney movie being made. It's like O.J. in the bronco and police chase. I know if someone i knew or loved died, possibly murdered, and there were rumors of me being connected to the death, i would do anything to not only clear my name, but more importantly find out the truth! Her actions do NOT portray that of an innocent person. Think about it.

I never really followed anything about the death of Kurt Cobain, and I always just assumed he killed himself because he was a "junkie" or so everyone portrayed him to be. However, after reading everything on this site and others, some of you people can't honestly just shrug it off as a suicide. [especially if you need to be corrected on what the actual lyrics were to his songs.] Music lost one of the greatest things it ever had going for it and probably ever will. Have a little more respect...

This is one of the biggest tragedies that has been known in the 20th century of music. Like everyone else that I have spoken with about it, I find everything about his death suspicious, and I do not think that he would have killed himself. He had a lot of problems, sure - but escaping from rehab and his apparent "junkie" image are not reasons that even close to justify the event. I am not saying that Courtney did this, but there are a lot of coincidences here that all point to her, I am wondering why its just a closed case and nobody has further looked into this legally, because the hype of it and all of its thoughts are often discussed online, and in everyday conversation as far as I know, if anyone knows why it isn't further persued, send me an email to discuss it with me. Kurt was a musical genious and I do not think that there would be that many successful bands around in the industry if it weren't for him and the other members of Nirvana. He may not have been the best role model, but I still believe to this day, if it wasn't for him, then I would not even know what good music is, and I was only 7 years old whenever he passed away. .
--Jesca
<mailto:Jess_5810034@yahoo.com>

Look anyone with half a brain can see this was no clear-cut suicide. For people to conclude it was a definite suicide based on a couple of lines Kurt wrote for a song is utterly ridiculas. That's the excuse the people who snuffed him have got - like 'yeah he wrote tones of suicidal reference man, no-one would even think anything less'. How stupid are these people? To wipe off fingerprints, forge a so-called 'suicide not', to tidy the syringe, heroin belt away in a box IT'S OBVIOUS THIS WAS A MURDER. And the person above nailed it when they said Love's actions are not those of an innocent person. So it seems a few of us have Love nailed - shame the law won'teven bother.
--Darren

kurt was FUCKING awesome. i remember when he died i heard where did you sleep last night over and over again, and i couldnt stop crying. He was my idol and still is, he made music life different, i will always love him. i wouldnt blame courtney for his death if i aint even sure, he always talked about suicide, but yes i admit he was very happy after frances was born. but he was on drugs, thats wat drugs do to people. and yea he was fucking stupid 4fm the beggining, but he's kurt, things wouldnt have been the same without him. I think he was the greatest fucking guy ever, and now thinking bout i feel bad 4 his old rat kitty that he accidently killed...Any fuckin ways i gotta go. just wanted to show you my opinion
--Caline
<mailto:nirvana_babe_555@hotmail.com>

But.. Can we do anything to find the truth?
Why this case was closed?.. It's so sad.. but I want to know what really happened :(
Am I the only one who believes that it wasn't a suicide and want's to know the answer even it happened long time ago?..
--Crash

i find that kurts death is nothing but a murder i have been reshearching this subject for 6 months now and all my evidence points to love and dewitt the nanny, kurt and love where constantly fighting and in the last few weeks of kurts life love seemed to be obsessed with kurts will kurt wanted out. out of the marrige, out of nirvana and out of seattle. so why wouldnt love want him dead so she could further her career she just wanted him for his money and there are a lot of people that would agree she never loved him
i hope to see this case re-opened so kurts name can be cleared for good
--tj
<mailto:psychotic_nympho_me@hotmail.com>

I still miss kurt every day, he was the most beautiful person I ever saw.
I have no idea if he killed himself or was killed, but I cried a million tears for him.

Kurt Cobain was a Legend, never meant for the 27 club. This case needs to be reopened, help me by signing my petition, 1000 signatures strong so far, thankyou http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/483037429?ltl=1168570072

peace
--Jill
<http://www.Cobainliveson.com>

Did Love do it? Kurt was really depressed, and he was always talking freely about killing himself. Im left without an answer
--DCK

Hey ill sign the petition. It does need to be reopened. I need to find out Suicide or Homocide.
--DCK

What about that other letter that Love had? They said it had 2 do with his suicide. that was a divorce note he wrote, he was gunna leave her and she didnt want that. she shot him up with 3 times over the limit of heroin and then pulled tha trigger. He wouldnt have been able to lift a finger with that much Heroin in him. I don't know about you other people but Love killed him.
--DCK

I'm pretty sure, that Courtney killed Kurt. It's just so fucking obvious. I'm dreaming of the day, when the truth will come out and there will be some justice for Kurt. I just hope, it'll happen before I die. Sorry for eventual mistakes, but english is not my native language. Love You Kurt:* Thanx for all[*]

ok...im sure courtney didnt kill kurt herself.she HAD him murdered.ive been reading up on this case 4 about 3 years &im sure he was murdered.PLEASE everyone read the book LOVE & DEATH by Wallace & Halperin.PLEASE & then decide if it was murder...dont say it was murder if u dont know anything. Kurt RIP contact me at:kfowkes@comcast.net

*sorry i meant dont say it was suicide if u dont know anyhing*

Courtney hired someone to kill Kurt. That's all there is to it. But I don't understand how they could just let this case close, especially since there WERE suspicions that Courtney was somehow responsible for the death of Kurt. It seems like the police didn't try very hard to look for answers. They just wanted to say that they solved it, and they didn't want to look into the possibility of homocide, so they pretty much just said "oh well. It looks like a suicide, so we might as well just say it was one. Nevermind the fact that someone could have killed Cobain and made it look like a suicide." They should have really looked at all of the possibilities. Courtney Love killed her husband, and she walks free today without a care in the world, other than looking like a piece of shit all the time. She should be in jail. Karma will come back and get her though. There's my two cents.
--Courtney
<mailto:courtney_03_09@yahoo.com>

Ew. I'm ashamed to have the same first name as her.
--Courtney
<mailto:courtney_03_09@yahoo.com>

Three doses of that crap would knock him right out, he wouldn't have enough energy left to pick up the gun and shoot himself. Courtney was facing a divorce anyways! She knew Kurt wanted out. PLUS The police claim there were no legible fingerprints on the shotgun! & there was no suicide note! That was a letter explaining to his fans that he was leaving the music business, There was only a short footnote to Courtney and Frances and the handwriting contained in those lines has been questioned by several handwriting experts.
--Emma
<http://www.myspace.com/emina_yay>

Ok, I understand, that this is definitely a homicide. But I still don't understand some facts about the body. Firstly, the person, who found Kurt, sayed, that out of the ears, he saw blood coming out, that the hair was groomed, as if Kurt came staight out of a stylist. He thought, that Kurt was just asleep. But excuse me, there was nothing left of the head. I couldnt see any ears, any nose, nothing. It was just some red mash. How could have he sayed that? He wasnt just standing at that one place. No, he moved a bit to get a closer look. And the smell. There was no mention of that. The body was lying there for about three days. And the brain, the eyes, the meat, could have easily provided any kind of smell.
Another thing, such a gun, no mather how big it was, couldnt have blown the head that way. If the gun was shot in the mouth, the head could have leaned forward to put the gun in the mouth, and the shot could have gone through the head, and came out at the back of it. Of course, the head could have sink in, but the skin could have been left. Or, the gun could have been placed under the chin. Then, the shot could have ripped half of the head of. But at this case, it looks like it was shot straight into the face. To me it looks like only something like a grenade could have done something like this.
Furthermore, there was practically no blood. Only at the place, where there once was the head. But the blast was powerful, and if it made a head into a mash, then the head should have been splated all around the room. But there was only a little bit of blood. So maybe, some one, cleaned the room after Kurt's death. Here is the page, where I found the pick.

http://maxidaniel.tripod.com/id2.html

The sad thing is, that the head looked like a mush, straight out of the butcher's. And a guy, that was getting divorced, leaving his sick wife and (absolutely) taking Frances with him, to a better life, couldnt have done something like this to himself. He could have left it all, moved in a new house with her, and lived quietly. But no, someone like Courtney, who is a leech, hired someone to kill him in such a terrible way. I'm just sad, because Courtney is getting all those milions, that belongs to Kurt, and she's spending them on drugs. Now, she's making a movie about him, saying "It will be an A list movie". Think about how much money she's gonna get from the fans, when they come to see it. I hope that people like Tom Grant, won't let the end look like a suicide, which she will without a doubt make. She will make their marriage look like "Romeo and Juliet" with no problems. And Frances, think about her. She was the last person who saw him. What nightmares she had. Oh my God, poor girl. She had drugs, sucked into her body when she looked something like an amoeba. And now, Courtney's kissing her in pictures, that are all around the internet. I would be disgusted, just by being next to her. I hope Frances knows the truth.
Finally, I think, that such a sensitive and creative person couldnt have done somethng like this. He loved his life at that moment. He was just too weak physically, to stop the murderer. The worst thing is, that it is just too late to cry and look for anwsers. What ever we do, we cant change the past. Kurt is dead, he's burned, he's gone. I just wish, that there was a time machine, so we could go back, and stop the murder. If I made some mistakes, or that pick isnt Kurt's, then let me know, because of it, I can't look at Kurt without crying.
--Justina
<mailto:prodigenical@yahoo.com>

Kurt didnt kill himself that fuckin bitch courtney love did it
--Katie
<mailto:munkee_gurl717@yahoo.com>

kurt defiently did not kill himself. i think that whorebag courtney did it.

what did the note suppposedly say? I am positive that he was not about to kill himself
was he that dramatic? The man was very quiet if you really looked at him,she nagged him for ever let's be stars rock stars me and you he did not want it like she did he went along and did it for her and hated it! the rest is is hstory!

I was born with the sounds of the Clash, no i was 16, sex pistols, stranglers, thedamned etc..... The Ruts and Malcolm Owen why did he kill hmself????John Peel reported it to me one night years ago!!! did anyone wonder about him?
its crap drama that this world is all about
celebrity means every thing to very shallow
people, sid and nancy anyone????
st
--LAZYGHIRLTOMMY

Do we give courteney that much influence? he was
pissed off, she wanted celebrity he did'nt
desperate person she was????is...... its all about getting my face on the front of People magazine!And we are better people than her!

Nirvana was so coool, this sucks.
--dave

Sweet Page you should check out mine i have a kurt cobain tripod website too lol...

Oh, this is really mature. Calling Courtney names. I thought everyone had the right of innocence until proven guilty.

Which Courtney hasn't been. There is no evidence against her and Cali. Absolutely nothing links either of them to the scene in the greenhouse other than exaggerations, theories and ideas from an incompetent "detective".

Nobody has come up with any evidence that specifically links Courtney or Cali to the death of Kurt Cobain. If you gave what Tom Grant and Frances Barnett have currently given to a court, they'll laugh you out of it. The police are absolutely right not to prosecute Courtney or Cali.

Tom Grant says he has evidence that could land them in jail but he won't release it until the case is reopened. Anyone not see the stupidity? He needs to release the evidence FOR the case to be reopened. And actually, if he does have hard evidence, he is committing a crime by not revealing it to the police. The man is a joke.

All the murder claims can be rebutted and have been. But the sheer desperation to pull a conspiracy out of this is ridiculous.


--Strider

kurt was murdered.if anyone thinks it was suicide then your dillusional, you most likely like to make excuses and rationalize, i mean, you dont even give it a second thought, your just like those damn seattle cops, rushing to judgement, because "it looks like a suicide so it is a suicide".
its common sense, espeically since theres absolutley no evidence indicating suicide, except heresay, but yet theres a huge amount of substantial evidence stating murder.
how do you sleep at night? what if this was your mom, i mean would you do what us kurt fans are doing and wanting to find the truth, or would you just accept it because MTV says so.

your brain must not be working correctly to be so closed minded while reading anything pertaining to it, i mean if you dont have a decision, thats fine, at least your considering any possibilty, but to be so one sided. i hope when its proven that kurt was murdered that your ran off the planet.

sorry i sound so mean, its not me feeling right now. i respect your thoughts that you think its suicide, but come on, get real, i guess once those photos are developed we will know the truth, the exact photos that courtney wanted destoryed.

i do to wonder why grant doesnt go to court, that would be obstruction of justice if he has all this evidence. maybe he needs the right time and evidence to SUPPORT the evidence he has.

you just cannot go through the pages reading it like its a blank page, you should read LOVE AND DEATH by max wallace and ian hallperin, now thats a read. it contains things that i had NEVER even heard before.

wow, one of the people way above me, about these emails written by cali, well "supposedly", honestly, i think eric erlandson had something to do with it, i mean kristen gets clean and after seeing eric she ends up dead? with heroin that courtney probabaly made dirty, since it was said that it WAS a gift from courtney.

like i said, you cant read this stuff like its a blank page, you have to keep an open mind. its scientifically impossible for kurt to have shot that gun. also i think in the reports the gun was laid perfectly on kurt. umm wouldnt that gun have fallen to the side or just have been kind of sloppy on his body if he shot it? someone else shot that gun, and kept a good aim on it.

courtney had something to do with this, im a big hole fan, i love them, but i know better than to be an idiot and to deny evidence in an act of favoritism. courtney had everything to lose. MONEY mostly, her daughter, even her career, she would have stayed on drugs and would have been known as kurts ex wife ONLY, i doubt her record would have gotten critical acclaim, if anything at all. she had more to gain with kurt being dead. he wanted to divorce her, and what does she have now? she owns the hole damn nirvana estate!!!

rome was her first attempt at murder. its so obvious.

i mean all of kurts family and friends are shocked about this supposed suicide, but courtneys not? why should we believe the self professed liar? oh because courtneys the only one who has the right to know kurts feeling? bull fucking shit. i belive dylan over courtney any day. all she did was plant seeds, and she thinks she got away with it.

i do think karma got around, look at tom grant! i doubt she expected that to happen, without him noone would be calling murder. so shes going to get whats coming to her, soon.
--amber

the last 4 lines of that suicide note are not kurts, it looks like someone tried desparatley to make it look like his, couldnt write as small, so they had to write it bigger.

i wonder why boddahs name is on it, that was kurts imaginary friend if you dont know. i think i want to know THAT more.

i wonder what was in that rootbeer can that kurt had that never got tested, that probabaly would have been a big factor. what if he was drugged, which is how he got so much heroin in him, i doubt you could just jam it in his arm without a struggle. hmmm there was rohypenol in that house, could that have been it?

and then she has the body cremated? could she be anymore obvious than she already is!!!

i find it funny that a lot of people take courtneys word for kurt supposedly being suicidal over daves or krists. isnt this the same girl that LIED about kurt being locked in a bathroom with a gun? hell why dont we believe kurt, who has said he wasnt suicidal.

i mean even if the note was a suicide note, i think it was something he wrote a long time ago, he makes a reference to his stomach, hmmm his stomach got way better around that time, i know hes said he wanted to die with that pain, but now that it was gone, he had nothing to die about. that was an old letter that courtney got and used it as the note with her own touchup.

come on, writting smaples found in her backpack? a note-2-self that said to get arrested. she need a damn alibi thats what it was.

kurts head was not even blown off his body, that was a lie!!! courtney feeds her own stories, shes her own source, shes a liar!.

i heard there was very little blood by kurt also, thats strange, unless he was dead from the heroin, which would make snes, because his blood would have stop flowing, which would make less blood.

you know what i think. cali drugged him up waited till kurt died, called the person hired to shoot kurt, kurt died while waiting with the heroin, then he was shot. thats what i think happened.

why was the stool in front of the door? was kurt sitting there waiting for his soon to be killer?

nothing adds up with his death you can deny it or not. i doubt courtney cares about her fans, all she cares about are her album sales, which when kurt went missing was all she could talk about. she knew he was dead on the 4th, thats why she made that call. thats why she faked a OD, so she would have an alibi.

and when she thought she was going to get caught she brings up cali saying that she knows he would "fuck her over", is this planting aseed in case she gets busted, she can blame it on him?.

and this eric erlandson, courtney seems to control him beyond. planting a sleeping bad and cigarettes, its so obvious!!!. delivering heroin to kristen, leaving after an hour!, trying to get her to do it, and he just HAD to watch and make sure? that sounds odd.

im wondering about the allen wrench theory also, hes very creppy in the love and eath book, a lexus??? el duce is dead??? payoff?

its also funny that courtney was so worked up if kurt was cheating on her, but yet she had an affiar with evan dando of the lemoheads, which she said herself.

honeslt, i think kurt and kristen might have had something going on. they got really close and courtney hated that, kurt even thought kristen was beautiful.

i think cali was using kurts credit cards too. i wonder who the second plane ticket was for though,.

and apparently this girl elizabeth, the one kurt leaves a number about, apparently theres something going on with her too.

its also obvious that courtney coached dylan and cali to call the greenhouse a "little dingy place".

i dont think krist and dave can speak out if they think it was murder, courtney owns nirvana basically she has leverage, she can stop all eraned money from them, she can do anything.

all dave said during an howard stern interview was basically no comment. hmmmm, it sounds like he wants to say something but cant.

all courtney wants is money, all she wanted from kurt was money, she would KILL for money.

im just sad that frances is in the middle of all of this.
--amber(the 1 b4 this was mine 2 )

in the love and death book, wallace says that they recieved a call from an anonymous source inside the SPD saying the case had been reopened, but when shithead cameron was told about it, he denied it. but yet documents were obtained stating that in fact the case had been reopen.

hmm was there a big payoff and a few death threats to close it right back up?

i find it odd also that nikolas hartshone was not only the coroner for kurt but also kristens, which in kristens file his name was crossed out, i wonder if he owed a favor to courtney. which is also one of her best friends.
--amber

and you know, this movie courtneys putting out, which im sure shell make it as if kurt committed suicide, its only going to bring her more attnetion. new fans of kurt which will look him up, i mean one of the seaches you will get is the murder theory, its mentioned everywhere. people will read that and believe in murder. so i think hes doing us all a favor.

ive been finding that more and more people are changing their minds to murder. this will get solved i bet yo uanything.

lets hope she didnt pay someone to get those photos of kurts body destoryed.

those photos will tell the tale, and will finally bring kurt justice.

get the word out, hell even people that arent fans of nirvana have thir opinion about kurt being murdered.

exposing him will get the word out, i mean even courtneys exposing him more haha, in her face.


--amber

Are you on IMDB per chance?

I've read all the theories. I'm not just coming into this blind. I've read it all and the murder theory is not based on any hard evidence. Its built on heresay. It would not stand up in court unless someone has significant other evidence (which I doubt quite frankly).

Onto your comments though:

I'm not accepting anything because MTV say so. Just because I'm not acting like some big rebel by playing up the murder theory...I'm not saying you are but people do do this.

Substantial evidence doesn't hold up in court. The evidence points towards suicide, nothing concrete suggests murder. If you are going to suggest murder much less accuse someone then you better have some damn good concrete evidence.

I sleep just fine at night. Thank you.

Grant has stated that he has the evidence to put Courtney and Cali away. He states that he evidence that proves (not just suggests - proves) that Courtney and Cali were involved in a conspiracy which resulted in the murder of Kurt Cobain.

If this is the case, then he is committing a crime by not releasing the evidence. If anyone else knows of the evidence and haven't released it to the courts, then they are also committing a crime.

Tom Grant says he will release the evidence when it gets to court. This is a contradiction in logic. For it to get to court, he has to release the evidence. If he doesn't release it, then it can't get to court. Leads me to believe that Grant is all talk. Just a guy, either fame hungry or money hungry, trying to keep his name out there. That or really stupid.

Unless there is proof that the heroin was dirty and that Courtney did it, there is no case to answer.

Nowhere has it said the gun was laid perfectly on Kurt. It said that it was laid pointing up and his chin and between his feet. I never saw them say what angle it was at in the police report. In fact, I think the photo (of Kurt's foot) was taken while the gun was still in his hand and I didn't see it apart from a shadow. Its not scientifically impossible.

Courtney may not have lost her daughter - Kurt was also a junkie who you could argue was unstable. A lot of people stood to make just as much out of Kurt - Geffen for example. Maybe more. Courtney was doing fine as a musician in her own right - and to argue about her record might have done is pointless because there is no clear answer to that.

Rome was probably an accident. In fact, if it wasn't for Courtney's intervention, he would have died in Rome.

Well, everyone has their difference opinions. There are some people that can collaborate Courtney's view like Duff from GNR who saw Kurt on a plane on his way back to Seattle and said he looked awful and Michael Stipe who said that he wanted to get Kurt out of Seattle so he could cheer him up. Dylan's opinion was that Kurt wasn't suicidal. Courtney's opinion was that he was. Neither would be more valid than the other and the only person who knew how Kurt was feeling was Kurt.

Actually, Richard Lee was calling murder before Tom Grant. Lee might be a wave short of an ocean but he called it before Grant. Grant's credibility was shot a long time ago.

There's no proof that Kurt didn't write the last four lines of the note. Lets just say - hypothetically - that someone had planned this out to murder Kurt. Then that is the worst and most embarrassing attempt at a forgery I've ever seen. Its not even close. The person doing it would at least try and imitate Kurt's writing. All you'd have to do is write small for starters. They don't even try. This suggests that it isn't a forgery. I think Kurt wrote the whole note - including the first line and the last four lines.

Maybe Kurt wrote to Boddah to try and remember better times, times when he felt good. I don't know, I'm not Kurt.

If someone had drugged him via the route beer, it would have turned up in his system. There would have been a mighty struggle, like you imply, if someone had jabbed a needle into his arm.






--Strider

So she had his body cremated? Maybe that's what he wanted when he died? Loads of people get cremated, it doesn't mean there's a conspiracy.

We don't know the reason for Courtney lying. Maybe she was genuinely worried that he was suicidal so she lied to get the police round. Calling the police doesn't sound like something that she would have done for the hell of it with her record.

The stomach reference seems metaphorical to me. I didn't take it to literally mean his stomach at that moment. Add to this that no-one knew how he was feeling at that time except him. He did lie to the press, remember. And in his songs.

Courtney already had alibis. She was miles away from Kurt when it happened. She could prove this in lots of ways. The hotel she was in would have a record of her phone calls so she was already watertight with her alibis. Getting arrested wouldn't really make a difference.

"Kurt's head was blown off his body" struck me as an exaggeration. Like when news articles say that he blew his head off to make a point. Its not literal, its an exaggeration of being shot in the head.

If he was dead from the heroin (ie not breathing), then why was he shot? You can only go for so long withbout breathing. All they had to do was leave him and that's it. Perfect death. Heroin overdose. Suicide. Why complicate matters by shooting him? It doesn't make sense.

If Kurt had died, no-one would have to shoot him. Job done. And there's no evidence against Cali at all.

Where else should the stool have been? Maybe that's just where it was in the room.

As I said, she already had an alibi and Courtney being self centred does not equate to Courtney being a murderer. That's a pretty huge leap in logic!

"Fuck her over" could mean anything in regards to anything. It is not evidence of a murder cover up.

Unless you know what was said between Kirsten and Eric at her place, then assumptions can't really be made. Assumptions aren't evidence.

Allen Wrench doesn't sound like the nicest guy but there is no evidence that links him to the death of Kurt Cobain and there is really no hard evidence to link him to the death of El Duce although I will concede that there is slight circumstantial evidence. But this does not in any way prove that Wrench is guilty of any wrongdoing.

If its Ok for Kurt having an affair, why is Courtney battered over hers?

The credit card theory doesn't actually prove murder, it takes away from the argument as it just draws attention to it. Grant argues that it stopped when Kurt's body was found - well of course it did! You'd have to be a pretty stupid thief to keep using the card of someone who was known to be dead! I wonder what tree Grant fell out of sometimes.

Do you have any evidence that Courtney coached Dylan and Cali to say anything? It doesn't make sense. If either or both of them were involved in a murder cover up, then they would know what Kurt's body would eventually be found. And that they would be outed as liars if they said it was a dingy place. So why say it unless they didn't think anything was amiss in there? Its another thing that doesn't make sense. If we are to assume that this was planned, they would have covered all bases with it.

Dave is already rich enough with the Foo Fighters to talk about whatever he wants. If he or Krist want their hands on the Nirvana state and believe it was murder than what better leverage than to publicly accuse Courtney? None.

Unless you know Courtney, then you don't know what she'd do for money.

I wish people would stop acting as if they care about Frances. Everyone of us on here are trying to satisfy our own curiosity or prove a point. I'd be willing to bet that none of us care about Frances.






--Strider

But evidently not officially. It was either closed again due to lack of evidence or the person who reopened it didn't do it officially and was a vigilante.

Unless you have proof of death threats, that's just a wild assumpsion that can't be taken seriously. Courtney does not have a power over the police either.

There are favours and there are murder cover ups. There is no evidence that he acted in any way innapropriately.

If Courtney is drawing more attention to it, then how does that make sense?

More and more people don't think for themselves - they parrot Tom Grant. You, at least, put together your own arguments. But most just parrot Grant.

Why wouldn't she want the photos destroyed? The case was declared a suicide and I doubt anyone would want photos of their husband's dead body floating around.

If Courtney did kill him, why would she want to speak about him?

And you can persuade people who don't know the details of the case anything depending on your point of view.


--Strider

yeah, if you so strongly believe in suicide then why do you come here, to people who do believe murder, your not going to change anyones mind. im not going to tell you to leave this site, that would be foolish, but why not go to a site were they believe the suicide theory.

lets see, kurt was divorcing courtney, i think thats a big enough motive. in fact it happens all the time. courtney inheretied the entire nirvana estate, i think her work paid off well.
shes a liar, nothing she says makes sense, she changes her story all the time, i dont see how anyone can believe her.

you must be a really big courtney fan right?

so how did kurt shoot himself with three times the lethal dose, i mean everyone calling suicide never answers this question. sounds like you probabaly work for the seattle police department yourself. do you need to save your reputation?

kurt wasnt suicidal. why would courtney call the shots AFTER kurt died. if courtney thought kurt was suicidal and he showed it then i think a hell of a lot more people would notice too. in fact, they all say he was looking really good.

so id like to hear your understanding on that.

yeah she had the body cremated, kurts GRANDPA a man he was very close to said kurt wouldnt have wanted that.

the evidence does not point to suicide, name one thing that points to suicide. ONE THING. and not something lieing courtney has said. tell me something thats proof it was suicide.

you have to admit yourself, the seattle police did a shitty half asses investigation, whos to say that its a suicide if they didnt even do their job. so you wont know.

ive heard people get coached into what to say, infact most of the time their stories sound identical. so dylan admits theres a greenhouse, and then later says its a small dirty room, exactly what cali said? you cant say it wasnt coached without thinking about that.

th murder evidence is not based on hersay, your suicide theory is. but id like to know how kurt shot himself, put everything away, took out his syringe, shot himself. and how the gun didnt move and didnt blow away or move. please tell me that. if you cant answer that then dont even try.

your probabaly going to say its possible, weres your proof that thats possible?

courtney had all the motive. i dont see why she gets the special treatment, just because shes your idol. shes my idol too and you dont see me denying whats right in my face.

everytime courtney mentions kurts name shes always adds in the word "depressed, troubled, suicide" nothing else but that. she seems like shes trying to build it up in peoples heads that thats what happened.

i think i read somehwere before how she went on about how edward norten was a better father to francis? what the hell!, lets see, kurt died before he got the chance. and kurt was at his happiest when francis was around.

and no more of that noone knows how kurt felt except him. because all of his best friends say hes not suicidal, in fact they would have picked up on it, its obvious when someones sad, dylan would not have bought kurt a gun, and lets see who says kurt was suicidal? oh yeah courtney. you know why she didnt say anything before he died. BECAUSE KURT WOULD HAVE LAUGHED IN HER FACE, and told the hole world about it. just like when he supposedly locked himself in a bathroom with a gun HE LAUGHED IN HER FACE.
--amber

im pretty sure the evidence grant has are probabaly witnesses that would testify, so i dont think he can go to jail, especially if his investigation is still going on and hes still gathering more information, would you go to trial with half asses proof? no you wouldnt. i think grants doing a thorough job and look at this.

lets see, why was kurt shot? well if your first mistake, *hem hem* rome, when he actually survived fro something he should have been dead for, i think you would close your tracks and make damn sure he will be dead.

an intervention? courtney wasnt serious about that, she was using more heroin than her, hell she invited over kurts JUNKIE friends, thats why kurt didnt take it serious.

and actually dave has more to gain from nirvana royalties than the foo fighters. i dont think he would want to get ripped off. HELL for all you know dave might be someone who will testify against courtney when this case is reopened! dav es smart enough theres something wrong with this case.

oh and if your a courtney obsessed fan, no matter what evidence is in your face your still going to think shes inoccent.

and he record sales wouldnt have done so great. im surprised they havent, live through this is a damn great album!, but its only sold 2 million within the span of 10 years. if she divorced from kurt i doubt she would have old that many, if kurt didnt die she wouldnt have gotten all those sympathy purchases.

she was more concered with her record sales then kurt being missing.

she called pretending to be kurts mom, why? because the police wouldnt have taken her serious! she had just called them 2 weeks prior with the same "kurt has a gun, suicide", and then she admitted TO THEM that she lied. you think shes going to be herself again? no, even i wouldnt.

yeah she did have an alibi, but in order to make her suicide pact crap sound anywhere true, she would have had to OD. in fact courtney was the one feeding all these stories to the press. oh yeah as she said "i pay people to do it for me sometimes". yeah.
--amber

i think the fact that kurt still had casual clothing on, and shoes, also reciepts he had from weeks ago, were in his pocket should be looked at. unless he didnt like to shower and not change his clothes, then theres something kind of odd about that. was he killed on arrival. was he killed because he was going to leave, before he could change his will and divorce courtney? when did kurt arrive at the house? only on the 4th, where was he before?

his clothing and those reciepts are a clue, POSSIBLY. im not saying for sure.

and if you dont belive in murder, you have to admit that the police did not do there job, everything was misplaced! they didnt investigate, they went there like it was a joke! admit that if you cant admit murder.
--amber

i think the fact that kurt still had casual clothing on, and shoes, also reciepts he had from weeks ago, were in his pocket should be looked at. unless he didnt like to shower and not change his clothes, then theres something kind of odd about that. was he killed on arrival. was he killed because he was going to leave, before he could change his will and divorce courtney? when did kurt arrive at the house? only on the 4th, where was he before?

his clothing and those reciepts are a clue, POSSIBLY. im not saying for sure.

and if you dont belive in murder, you have to admit that the police did not do there job, everything was misplaced! they didnt investigate, they went there like it was a joke! admit that if you cant admit murder.

oh yeah, something else, if kurt shot himself them why was one of his arms lying on the floor while his other arm was holding the end of the gun? wouldnt he have needed both for aim? and even if he had aim, wouldnt it have been a sloppy shot? wouldnt his arm that was on the floor still be attached to the trigger? in a lot of "suicide" cases, well true ones, the victim usually still hand a han on the trigger, well if there laying on the ground. at least from few i read about.
--amber

i do give you respect for not coming into this blindly. i applaud you for that. most people have never looked up one thing to make a decision, im glad you did. but theres evidence and mishandling for the murder theroy thing comes to mind as more of having a chance.

i dont think people try to think their rebels for saying it was murder. if you can name one person i might believe that, but if you have no names then it probabaly isnt true. like we say. ITS HERESAY.

besides, most people are too into that emo crap to care if kurt was murdered or killed himself.

i just want justice!, i mean if some guy snatched my purse out of my hands, i would chase the bastard down, i wouldnt let him take off with my property. justice is all we want. if kurt was murdered we want the ones responsible for it to go down. if somehow there was some sort of "miracle" for the suicide followers that he killed himself, then at least he got the justice we all deserve, and a proper investigation.
--amber

but i think we know why courtney said she was wendy oconnor, so she could have more credibility. she had already lied to the police about kurt having a gun.

shes wasnt genuinley concerened about kurt, more like genuinley concerned about her record sales and career.

she did not care about kurt, she wanted money. she wanted all of his money. she needed him dead to get all of him money.

and i would like to know why the last 4 lines of that letter also looks a lot like courtneys. i bought her dirty blonde diary book (its great by the way) and her writting looks just like the last 4 lines, also her writting is kind of big, just like the last 4 lines.

but aww theres some cute pictures of her and kurt, like mall booth pictures. and kurt wearing a wedding dress, its hilarious, he has lipstick on too, haha and hes laying in bed. i wish i could scan them for you guys to see.

oh yeah and in all the pictures he looks HAPPY, not depressed, not lagging, HAPPY, like he couldnt get happier. and pictures are worth a thousand words.

and noone tell me hes probabaly faking it. fuck you if you do. kurt has the right to be happy and have a good time. and not stuck with that stupid suicide image.

and his lyrics, most of the lyrics, kurt admitted he just threw together to make songs, oh and all of his songs were written way before they were put on albums, so if they seemed sad, then they were probabaly from like 1989 or something.
--amber

oh yeah you mentioned something about imdb?, i heard of it, i actually have a friend that goes on there and talks about kurts death, we share opinions and such. i chose here though. imdb is too closed minded.

oh yeah, michael hutchins, singer of INXS. died of sexual asphixia (i dont know what its called), it was written off as a suicide, from poor investigation, but when his wife said he practiced that it was reopened, and then decided that it was in fact sexual asphixia, but due to the reputation the police would not change their suicide verdict from suicide to accident. BECAUSE OF REPUTATION. you see, i doubt any police dep. would want to risk their pathetic reputation.

crime scenes are mistaken as suicides a lot. and with the right kind of money, such as a 200 million dollar nirvana estate, i think you can keep it a suicide.

i mean all the people who claim suicide always ask for proof that its a murder, and once we give that they dont accept it. but yet when we ask what proof it was suicide they have nothing to say.

if you can asnwer how it was possible for kurt to have shot that gun please do tell. if you can answer why courtney had writting samples in her backpack that odd enough looked very alike to the last 4 lines, then please do tell.

if you discard the information about the 1.52 morphine, then give me some proof that you took a class that deals with that kind of stuff, and give me proof that your a professional. if not, then its very clear there is evidence that ot was a murder.

why no prints on the gun, the pen and the box of paraphenilia. did kurt do that too? why would kurt wipe off all prints from everything he touched.

oh yeah and dylans remark "the house never looked so clean". hmm was there a struggle in the house and kurt when drugged, was taken to the greenhouse, how do we know that was the only scene?.
--amber

if it was a murder, then the greenhouse was not the only place kurt was. why would kurt go to the greenhouse?. there was a struggle, nowhere else in the house was checked. there could have been vital evidence in the house, but the scene was the greenhouse.

oh yeah and lieing courtney, "there was a note under my pillow"...ummm and you believe her? the pillows were checked, there was not another note. ha, courtney at it again, lieing, and people believeing her. she only likes you when you buy her cd.

and kurt wasnt the one doing heroin while pregnant, you know why courtney didnt sue vanity fair? BECAUSE THEY WERE RIGHT AND THEY HAD EVIDENCE!. the same reason why she wont sue tom grant because she KNOWS HE HAS SOMETHING ON HER. youd think she would have a line of people to take to trial. but no, not one, becausethey have their evidence and she doesnt want to acknowledge them, that would bring more attention.

and yes the movie shes making, it will bring more attantion. celebrity searchers, you know when thers publicity they get looked up. if you type in kurt cobain you get tom grants site, im sure many poeple will look there.
--amber

oh and no thing about how kurt had a tolerance level. kurt was off drugs for months, the rome incident, there were no drugs in his body. his friends have said that he wasnt doing drugs. so what his tolerance was dropped.

kurt weighed 115, he was very little, his tolerance would not have been able to carry that much. i know a heroin ADDICT, who weighs 120 i think, and at a height of 5'5, shes been doing heroin for probabaly 12 years, well from what i know of, shes in her late 30s, she still does it, her tolerance level isnt even that high. so no, i doubt kurts was.
so theres some more proof. and kurt stopped using heroin, or at least not as much.
--amber

and kurt was also shot, to make it more like a suicide. if it was just a drug overdose, well they would have checked the amount, saw it was suspicious, and that he would have been knocked out at some point. and a lot of people wouldnt buy it. but suicide, thats believable, obviously...

but i go by making sure he was dead, since they failed with the rome attempt, thinking kurt was dead but he survived. besides, they would need to sedate him, if not he would be running all around and they wouldnt get a good shot. it needed to be staged. theres plenty of cases that remeble this one.

i mean, dylan says kurts not suicidal, but yet says he doesnt believe in the murder stuff, then what? obviously he doesnt think kurt was suicidal, why would he by him the gun? so someones keeping his mouth shut, obviously a few threats, maybe some money, who knows. i know dylan knows more than hes letting on. i think he knew where kurt was, i think he probabaly saw kurt lying there, theres more. maybe this is the evidence tom grant has, maybe dylan stepped up and spoke more. along with others who knew more. i think thats the evidence, he has testimonys, he doesnt have physical evidence, but he has kurts best friend and associates word on it. thats just my opinion.

--AMBER

and everyone whos so into the suicide thing, why come to a MURDER discussion, im not saying your not allowed, its just kind of strange. do you think your going to change our minds? and sway our thoughts? it deffinatley wont be mine. i considered suicide for a time, but with the evidence screaming right in the faces of many its hard not to cosider THAT.

everyone who believes in murder, dont give up on that, no matter what, dont let anyone get you down, and dont let anyone try to change you.

i dont care to start fights with anyone, thats so 7th grade. clean debates are welcome to me.
--amber

wait how can you say none of us care about francis? i care about her, shes half of kurt, and i care a hell of a lot about kurt. so you can not even think to say something like that. maybe YOU dont care, but just because you dont doesnt mean everyone else doesnt.

i dont parrot tom grant, in fact from his evidence or whatever i created my own in a way. well arguments as you said. (thanks for noticing that)

courtney would want the photos destroyed because WHEN the case gets reopened, those will say if he was in fact murdered or killed himself. youll want to get rid of ALL evidence if you want a get away. i know i would
--amber

hi i have come on this site as i am a huge fan of kurts and nirvana. to be honest i havent read or studied as much as some ppl have but i think if there are so many ppl that want this case reopened then surely the police should reopen the case of kurts death i am a strong beleaver that he was killed but would acept a police case saying it was suicide as long as i felt this was done propley and wasnt a rush or a half done job as i susspect sadley it would be. i would aslo like to take this chance to reassure ppl that there is a a new generation of ppl that will keep pushin this to the max

Suicide is the official verdict so there wouldn't be a Cobain suicide theory site. And its a good thing that I'm here. If people want to argue their case for murder then I'm probably the lowest person you have to worry about. There's a court that has to be convinced by people who think the same as you.

Kurt MAY have been divorcing Courtney. Many people say they are going to get divorced or threaten it and don't end up doing it, be it that they make up or are going by anger adrenelin at the time. Whether it would have gone through with it or not, we won't know.

I like Hole. As for Courtney's private life, I really don't care.

"Allegedly" three times the lethal dose. You forgot to add that word. I have seen one newspaper report (and you know how papers exaggerate or bend truth) and no other documents that back this up.

You do not know whether Kurt was suicidal unless you were in his head. That IS a fact. For the record, a few people have said and implied that he wasn't so good. Duff from Guns N Roses and Michael Stipe are two.

Having a body cremated is not proof of anything. Maybe Kurt changed his mind.

One thing: the note. It is the biggest indication of suicide.

The Seattle Police have not helped themselves with some of the comments made by individual officers. However, it does not prove murder.

Maybe it is a small dirty room? Depends on your persepctive. I notice, like a lot of theorists, you believe Dylan when it suits you to believe him. He's either reliable or he's not.

Who suggests he put everything away? People are acting like its something methodical he did as though he had to concentrate. If he's sitting next to his box, maybe he just drops it back in. The "he packed everything neatly away" thing is totally blown out of all proportion. Who says the gun didn't move? It said it was laying on him, barrel pointing at his chin, butt between his feet. It didn't mention anything about angles. His hand would have closed around it due to rigor mortis but it doesn't mention angles at all.

Of course suicide is possible, just look at the evidence. There is no firm evidence that Kurt Cobain was murdered.

Courtney is not my idol. Lots of people had motive - I can imagine there were several people that personal and professional issues with Kurt. Its not special treatment, I'm just not condemning someone when there's no solid evidence that proves she was involved in a murder conspiracy.

Er, maybe because he was depressed and troubled through his life (by his own admission) and because he is legally recognised to have comitted suicide?

Seeing as I know neither man and I'm guessing, neither do you, and Courtney was in intimite relationships with both of them, I think Courtney is better placed to judge Kurt Cobain and Ed Norton's parenting skills or lack thereof than either of us.

Well, its not obvious a lot of the time otherwise the records of suicide would probably be significantly less. I'll give you an example: Feeder. I don't know how familiar you are with the band but their drummer, Jon Lee, killed himself. Most people (his friends, his fans) knew him and saw him as a happy go lucky, friendly guy. Which is why, it admittedly came as a total shock to everyone when we hung himself. No-one expected it, no-one saw him coming. Grant (Feeder's vocalist) felt so guilty that he never answered a phone call from Jon on the day of his suicide because he had NO IDEA that Jon was so down and he was his best friend. Its the same in a lot of cases. That's why so many people are shocked when their loved ones commit suicide. Because they never saw it coming.


--Strider

Amber, it seems that you follow our groups motives and mission. Are you sending your share of letters out to the Seatle FBI or the national FBI, Mayor of Seattle, Chief of Police, Attorney General, or Governor of Washington State. This goes for everyone. please send out your own or a prefabricated letter found on so many websites. Let's bombard them with letters to make a permanent mark on the fact Kurt Was Murdered and the case needs to be re-opened inorder for justice to prevail. Dave Ashley
--dave Ashley
<mailto:davecashley@yahoo.com>

Amber, it seems that you follow our groups motives and mission. Are you sending your share of letters out to the Seatle FBI or the national FBI, Mayor of Seattle, Chief of Police, Attorney General, or Governor of Washington State. This goes for everyone. please send out your own or a prefabricated letter found on so many websites. Let's bombard them with letters to make a permanent mark on the fact Kurt Was Murdered and the case needs to be re-opened inorder for justice to prevail. Dave Ashley
--dave Ashley
<mailto:davecashley@yahoo.com>

If Grant has witnesses that would testify, why haven't these witnesses come forward to the police? If they have and were ignored, Grant could take this higher than Seattle police and go to their superiors. If they haven't, they have committed a crime by witholding evidence. Either way, Tom Grant doesn't seem to grasp that he needs to TELL the courts what he has. If he doesn't, nothing will happen. He has SPECIFICALLY SAID that he will release the evidence WHEN the case is reopened. He hasn't said he is still collecting. He says that he HAS it and will only reveal it when the case is reopened. This is a CONTRADICTION IN LOGIC and is also ILLEGAL!

If Kurt was dead, he would not be breathing. If he's not breathing, he's not going to live for very long. You just sit and wait for a few minutes and that's it, he's dead. Shooting him makes no sense. If you stop breathing or your heart stops, then you aren't surviving unless someone resussitates you. The theory that they "shot him when he was dead" makes no sense.

An intervention and sending Kurt to rehab makes no sense if Courtney was planning to kill him. If she was, why did she encourage him to go to Exodus? If he's out of state, she doesn't know where he is. Keeping him in Seattle at all costs and under guard would make more sense.

But you are acting like Dave can't speak as a huge source of his income is cut off. Its not. And besides, if Dave suspects something or knows something, its in his interests to speak as he can then contest the rights to the Nirvana estate. If Tom Grant has evidence that can "land Courtney in jail", then it makes more sense for Dave to come right out with it as if Courtney is found guilty then she no longer has the rights to the Nirvana estate.

I am not a Courtney obsessed fan. Is that all you can throw at me? Just because I don't believe that Kurt was murdered doesn't mean I'm some kind of Courtney nut. Courtney is entitled to the presumption of "innocent until proven guilty" though. And she has not been proven guilty. Not by a long shot.

Actually, Cobain's death, if anything, took attention away from that album so it may have adversely affected it.

Being selfish and being a murderer is a pretty huge leap in logic. As I've said, I don't doubt she's selfish. But does that make her a murderer? No, it doesn't.

The pretending to be Kurt's mum thing is neither here nor there. Her previous troubles with the police might have led to the police not taking the report as seriously which actually suggests that she wanted it taken seriously.

But she didn't make her OD sound a like a suicide. So talk about a suicide pact doesn't make a lot of sense. Either way, she had a clear alibi and more. There was nothing to be gained by ODing. She probably did it for attention.

Kurt wasn't the most hygenic guy in the world by all accounts. He probably was wearing what he was in when he left Exodus. It doesn't prove anything.

What do you believe was misplaced?

Rigor mortis would account for his arm being clenched on the floor. If it twitched to the side at the moment of impact, then it would have laid there and the rigor mortis would explain the clenching.

A lot of people do tend to spout it at people to be rebellious. I'm referring to posts of "OMG! Courtney killed him! She's a bitch!" which is just utterly pointless spamming.

An investigation can't come out of public clamouring though. Only if there is enough evidence that warrants re-opening it. Which I don't believe there is at the moment.

Again, you don't know how concerned or not she was about him. She would have got a lot of money off him had she divorced him. Child support for starters. Kurt would have had little to no chance of getting sole custody. She could have taken him for a hell of a lot. You seem to be suggesting she would make no money out of divorce which is not right.

The last four lines of the letter are highly likely to be Kurt's.





--Strider

Kurt may well have been happy at that point but that's no indication that he was always happy or that he was happy at the end of his life. Your point here doesn't stand up. He was known to suffer from bi polar disorder.

His song lyrics have nothing to do with the case and don't prove or disprove anything.

IMDB is close minded because they disagree with you? Isn't that a closed minded attitude to take? I mean, I don't agree with you but I'm hearing you out. Its a bit harsh to call people closed minded because they don't think the same way as you.

The Michael Hutchins case is completely different. Sexual axphixia is always hard to call as its very practice means strangling yourself so unless there's a note or something like that, its very hard to call.

Courtney Love does not have power to silence the whole police force.

The note, Cobain's fragile condition, no hard evidence of murder, no evidence to prove anyone else was in the room with him. All of this leads so suicide.

And the onus is on the murder theorists to prove it was murder. People don't actually have to prove its suicide as that is the verdict. You're the ones who want it changed so its on you to prove it.

Which hasn't yet been given. There is no hard evidence of murder or against Courtney Love, Cali Dewitt and/or Allen Wrench.

Kurt would be in a sitting position. He'd fire into his mouth, fall back, the gun would come at at angle on top of him with his hand on or around the gun. He'd have a better reach sitting up than lying down.

Even handwriting experts have said that the last four lines are not conclusively not Kurt's. And the rest of the note points to suicide anyway. Its obviously a suicide note.

A class that deals with what?

There were prints on the gun. They just weren't legible. Same with the pen. The paraphenilia wasn't checked for prints, I believe. The gun's lack of legible prints could be due to the police having to pry it out of Kurt's hands and having to transport it in a case. It could also be due to the room temperature as it was there for a few days. Ditto with the pen, which had to be pulled around a bit.

Let me rephrase your question and give it to you - how do you know it wasn't the only scene? Is there any evidence that states otherwise? If there a was a scene in the house, Cali's girlfriend would have heard it.

Maybe Kurt liked the greenhouse. There is no evidence that anything went on in the house. The door to the greenhouse was locked (and yes, I know what kind of lock it was). There was no evidence that anyone else had been in the greenhouse. Why would the police need to search for evidence of a suicide in the house?

According to Grant, there wasn't another note. Who only likes you when you buy his case manual. I have no interest in the so called word of Tom Grant which is no more reliable than the so called word of Courtney Love.

You contradict yourself. If Courtney is doing a movie which in some way would deal with Kurt's suicide, she is drawing attention to it. Which makes no sense amongst your claims against Tom Grant. She doesn't need to sue Grant. She has enough money and he doesn't have enough evidence. There's not really much point in suing the guy! She doesn't even have to acknowledge him. He's not a member of the police.

Everyone has a different tolerance level and you do not know Kurt's. However, Krist said that his tolerance level was high.








--Strider

Hang on, you aren't making sense. If they checked the amount of heroin in Kurt, had he overdosed and were unsure about suicide as he would have been out of it then why would they believe that a dead Kurt could have shot himself? If that was true, then it would add to a murder theory, not take away from it.

You check someone's dead by seeing if they're still breathing. Its very simple. If he's not breathing, he's dead or he will be in five minutes. There would be no "unsure" feelings about it.

Dylan is probably saying Kurt wasn't suicidal either because he genuinely believes it and was wrong or because he is trying to cover his own back. The public would cane him back to the stone age if he had a feeling Kurt was suicidal yet bought him a gun anyway.

If Dylan spoke more and he and Tom Grant haven't gone to the police then they are both breaking the law and are both in trouble. There's no evidence that Dylan knows anything more about Kurt's death and there's no evidence that he is anything other than a stoned idiot.

Frances is Frances. And how do you think she feels hearing her mother being accused or murder with nothing solid to back up the allegations? Yeah, not good. Its curiosity. Nothing more.

Courtney would want the photos destroyed because what sick person would want to keep photos of their dead husband? Particuarly if there was a chance of them making their way online.

People can push this all they like, unless evidence comes up, it ain't getting to court. Simple as.




--Strider

first of all, it wasnt ALLEGED, it was in kurts file or whatever that it was in fact 1.52, they obtained these records through the freedom act, you didnt need permission to get these, in a way.

while i see what your saying, well let me clear things up because people are probabaly thinking that im on a tirade haha, im just sitting here sipping coffee, very calmly. but anyways, im not blocking out what you think about how it could have been suicide. the letter, if its not kurt s or if noone knows for sure then its not evidence of a suicide. if they dont know for sure about the handwritting then noone has anything.

besides, i would think the letter might have been longer, kurt was a very considerate person. you would think hed add in krist or dave or something about nirvana, maybe something to his family, but only the fans, which did indeed sound like it could have been a retirment note. but why not anything to anyone else, why something so short about francis. if he was going to kill himself then he would try to make his last days to live and good as possible, he probabaly would have visited francis one last time before going to seattle, contacted people, hell maybe he did contact people but had no plans to kill himself.

why not leave out the front door? he climbed the wall, so possibly trying to make a getaway that courtney wouldnt know about.

he WAS planning on divorcing courtney, its a FACT, she said herself, their attorney said so, dave and all his friends said so. courtney was a bitch to kurt, you think hed want to stay in that position? he was with her for so long for the sake of francis. he was going to divorce her, he was going to take her out of his will. all she cared about was his money. kurts not dumb.

and no its not the only thing i can throw at you, i was being sarcastic about that "courtney obsessed" taunt.

oh and what i mean by the gun, i mean if the pictures were looked at then they could determine the positions of the gun or whatever, to see if he fired it or if someone else did. the pictures are what need to be looked at. those are the major evidence.

why would they still shoot kurt? why would a killer leave his/her prints at the scene or a drivers I.D? people screw up, and im sure more dont think.

when the case is reopened, he will present his evidence, how do you know he hasnt stepped forward with this? how do you know a judge or whatever didnt tell him to holdo nto it, how do you know it isnt in police custody? i think grants smart enough to know that. yeah i too was skeptical when i heard somewhere he was holding onto it, but it could be possible he has turned it over.

things were misplaced at the crime scene, such as the letter, it was first in the flower pot, kurts drivers license, probabaly other stuff too.

yeah courtney was concerened about kurt, HIS MONEY.

i heard a tape by grants, there was more that rosemary carol said to him, thats not on the internet, that she thought maybe kurts handwritting was traced and put together, THATS ROSEMARYS thought not mine. and its said by courtney that his "suicide note" was written on a ihop paper. an ihop paper? yeah i dont think kurt would be that ungreatful if he was killing himself.

his lyrics dont have anything to do with it, but someone said, i dont remember who, that kurts lyrics foreshadowed his death. i doubt it.

courtney set up that intervention because something about geffen, i dont remember what i read, so i cant give a thought on it. but i know it had to do with geffen.

and daveashley im doing my best to spread the word to get the case reopened, im also trying to contact the seattle police and what-not. i think your the owner of this site? thanks for having it up. ive been printing flyers and sticking them into library books, and posting up flyers on trees and everything i can do to get the attention.
--amber

well lets see, its supposedly a suicide because of a note that might not or may be kurts, so thats not proof of a suicide if its not dicided.

and SOME people (2 people) say kurt didnt look so good, but the majority say he was not suicidal. including his BEST FRIENDS and FAMILY.
yeah thats not proof of a suicide either.

so courtney wa the only one saying kurt was suicidal, said the rome incident was a suicide attempt, AFTER kurt died, thats a little suspicious, seems like shes panting her seeds so her side of the story can be more believable.

courtney had a motive, she would have gotten more that geffen and anyone else, she WAS married to him with a child. she was so obsessed with money and fame.

motive right there.



--amber

were there any records that kurt was bipolar? ive never seen one, only by what some people have said. did he take pills for it? ive never heard of him taking pills. so unless i get proof that he was depressed like that well i might belive it

this guy in that band you were talking about, how do you know he wasnt murdered. because suicide gives poeple more cloure? and yes it does, noone wants to hear that someone they loved was MURDERED.

if kurt was depressed it was because of his golddigging wife courtney. i mean how is it that EVERYONE kurt was close to say courtney ALWAYS said something about money, and that thats what she was in for.

like i said, his clothes probabaly werent a clue if he just didnt like to change his clothes, but if he did like to shower and COULD have and WOULD have if he did get to take one, then i think looking at that might say something.

well you can think suicide all you want, when this case is reopened, when those photos are developed, and if its said he was murdered then what?. i can accept if it was suicide if its done better at an investigation and courtney doesnt interfere and bribe peope with money.

but im sure the smart ones will see that somethings not right.
--amber

everyone should admit that the seattle police departent did not do their jobs. they half assed everything, and wanted to leave just as quickly as they got there. they did no testing, but luckily tests outside of the crime scene were done and there were pictures.

the SPD did not do what they were supposed to. everyone admit that.
--amber

unless your a professional private detective and actually wored with courtney love and had first hand knowledge, did your work, then i will not take what you say as a fact. grant knows what hes talking about. i dont think he cares if you buy his manual, hes spent more money investigating this case then he will recieve back, but in time, he will be awarded.

i mean if all you have as proof of suicide is a note that could have been written by, thats its not sure of, then you have nothing.

if you have only 2 people saying he didnt look good, but hundreds more saying he wasnt suicidal, then you might not have anything.

oh and kurts death did affect courtneys sales, ive known people who only bought it because it was kurts "greiving wife" who was also screweing billy corgan. so something worked out for her.
--amber

unless your a professional private detective and actually wored with courtney love and had first hand knowledge, did your work, then i will not take what you say as a fact. grant knows what hes talking about. i dont think he cares if you buy his manual, hes spent more money investigating this case then he will recieve back, but in time, he will be awarded.

i mean if all you have as proof of suicide is a note that could have been written by, thats its not sure of, then you have nothing.

if you have only 2 people saying he didnt look good, but hundreds more saying he wasnt suicidal, then you might not have anything.

oh and kurts death did affect courtneys sales, ive known people who only bought it because it was kurts "greiving wife" who was also screweing billy corgan. so something worked out for her.
--amber

im not closed minded about this, i have my reasons as why i think it could possibly be a suicide, and i have my reasons for murder. im not talking about suicide because this is for muder theorists. what i do know as a fact is the crappy work the police did. but im more into thinking it was murder.

if my friend thinks imdb is close minded then thats her, i only get on there to see what people have to say about harry potter.
--amber

and what i meant about there possibly being 2 crime scenes, there wasnt enough blood in the greenhouse crimescene, unless he was long dead and then shot. if he was shot right after then he was shot somehwere else, where the majority of his blood went, the greenhouse was only checked, dylan said the house had never been so clean. somethings suspicios
--amber

if its reported that duff saw kurt not looking good, there was also a friend (cant remember who) that said kurt "was in fear for his life" and soon after bought the shotgun.

i think there were 2 scenes, how do you not lose that much blood, unless you were killed long after, it was in the police reports about his blood, if i find the source ill post it.

how long before or after did stipe say he wanted to save kurt? to save him from courtney?

usually after suicides that when people, if they never "saw the sighns", they look for anything so they wont feel guilty, some even exaggerate to give them closure in a suicide.

my minds a bit foggy now (studying for my test)

ok i dont know if this is correct or true, but did the shotgun get destroyed? if it did then i think we know what happened. but what happened to the gun?

and kurts tired were slashed? someone must have not wanted him to leave.
--amber

strider, i am sort of glad your here, i like having someone to debate with, i dont know, you help me get what i want to say out more. i hope theres no hard feelings between us, you probabaly dont like me but if i came off as "unspirited" to you, then i appologize, well ALL APPOLOGIES :D

but, to the ones who believe murder. when did courtney start telling dylan to check the greenhouse and for grant and dylan to go back to the house. the 7th right?, and they found the note by cali, well if its true that there wasnt a lot of blood, did cali not only write the phony note but also move kurts body IF THERE WERE 2 SCENES, im not saying that was a fact, so i dont want anyone arguing with me about that. but courtney said check the greenhouse, why not on the 5th? or the 6th?, but the 7th, was there something going on, did they finally have the body in a better place? the greenhouse. i dont know. nevermind.
--amber

so i remember a few more things, it is DOCUMENTED proof that kurt was going to divorce courtney and possibly take custody of francis, and he was also going to take courtney out of his will.

also his cars tires were flat and his credit cards were blocked. someone did not want him to leave. andthis happened once he got to seattle.
--amber

and it was in kurts autopsy report that there was 1.52 morphine and also valium.

oh, nikolas hartshore, the coroner for kurt, passed away in 2002 if anyone didnt know. i guess he was doing base jumping.
--amber

thats strange, i read that kurt never kept journals? huh? the quote below is taken from a site. how did kurt not write his journals, (the book that was realeased). hypothetically speaking, if he didnt, then who did?

based on this July 1993 interview Kurt did with Guitar World magazine, in which he mentions "I've never kept personal journals, either. I've never kept a diary, and I've never tried to write stories in the poetry; it's always been abstract." Hmm...

--amber

i got this off of a site, FAQ's reguarding this case. also something about this dream machine crap story that went around, so i hear courtney hired these people to throw everyone off.
but anyways

Why was the ejected shell of the shotgun found to the left and not the right of the body? This one is extremely important. More important than the heroin in my opinion.
Why were standard tests not performed such as a GSR kit, analysis of the contents of the root beer can, (read the reports the can was found with liquid in it but logged into evidence as empty) fingerprinting of the greenhouse, etc.

Were any trajectory tests done to show what the position of the shotgun was when it was fired? If not why weren't they done?

Were any measurements taken to see if it was even possible for him to shoot the gun? If not why weren't the done? The picture of him with the toy gun is just that a toy gun this shot gun was much longer and Kurt wasn't a big guy.

Why did Sgt. Cameron lie to Tom Grant about Kurt being barricaded in the greenhouse and that the little 'stool was wedged up against the door'?

Why were items logged into evidence in the case turned back over to Courtney before the case was even 30 days old?

STRANGE BEHAVIOUR
Why did Courtney pretend to be Kurt's mother when calling in the missing person's report to the SPD on April 4th?

Why didn't Courtney tell Grant and the SPD that Kurt had been seen at their home on April 2nd?

Why was Grant told to watch a drug dealers house and check hotels for Kurt, but not told that Dewitt had seen him at the house?

Why did Dylan not show Grant the greenhouse when Rosemary Carroll is recorded as telling Grant that she heard Courtney tell Dylan to look in the Greenhouse.

Why did Rosemary Carroll think Kurt's death was suspicious? Why did she tell Grant about the divorce and the will? Why is she now silent?

Why did Courtney release that cropped image of Kurt with the toy gun, shortly after his death?

Why didn't Eldon Hoke (El Duce) come forward sooner?

"Frances and Courtney, I'll be at your altar." - Why doesn't anyone ever question this part of the note?

Why did it take 2 years for Sgt. Cameron to say that a rookie must have made a mistake in the police reports about "the marks on Kurt's hands" ?

Why hasn't Courtney sued Tom Grant for his claims, but yet sues everyone else on a spin of a dime?

Where was Pat Smear during the week of April 1st - April 8th?

Why didn't Nikolas Hartshorne the coroner, disclaim and deny the 1.52 mgs of heroin that was found in Kurt's body at the time of death after he has done numerous interviews (VH1 Confidential)?

Why did Rosemary Carroll, Kurt and Courtney's entertainment attorney, tell Tom Grant that "Kurt was not suicidal"?

Why did Rosemary Carroll tell Tom Grant that the note left by Michael "Cali" DeWitt sounded phony?

Why did Rosemary Carroll tell Tom Grant that Courtney had "no business in Los Angeles"?

If all of Kurt and Courtney's friends knew that he was suicidal, why didn't they keep an eye on him?

If Dylan Carlson knew Kurt was suicidal, why did he buy the gun for Kurt?

When Courtney found out that Kurt fled rehab, why did she contact a PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR and not the POLICE first?

Why didn't Courtney go back to Seattle to help locate and maybe save her "suicidal husband"?

Why didn't Courtney call all their friends and family up in Seattle and organize a massive search party the minute Kurt fled the rehab and headed back to Seattle?

Why did Rosemary Carroll back off Grant after he replied to the letter he received from her firm threatening to sue him? Did he strike a chord or something?

Why did Courtney want to keep Grant on the pay roll and get him to sign a confidentiality agreement if he had openly admitted to her what his feelings of Kurt's "suicide" were?

What happened to Cali, and why was he always around - in Rome, at the house, whenever there was a problem? Why wasn't he ever really interviewed/questioned?


Who else did the confidentiality agreement effect besides Rosemary Carroll? i.e. other friends/associates of Kurt and Courtney who can not speak about this, even if they wanted to?



--amber

http://www.angelfire.com/home/KCWMTV/kcwm.html

this is a site to another investigator who has done A LOT more work than grant. noone has probabaly heard of him, but hes dont possibly more investigating.

also, its funny how in the infamous picture of kut theres absolutley NO BLOOD anywhere. also a tape was recovered that the other investigator saw, that had everything in the room and kurt on tape and you could see everything, and there was no blood. and when this investigator asked about it nikolas hartshorne and the SPD changed there story about 4 times saying that it "was on the right side that the blood came out", "that there was no exit wound", and other stuff....hmmm i wonder why they chaged their stories so many times.

which kind of says, was kurt murdered in that room? was he cleaned up?, the electricioner says kurts hair looked brished.

i dont know, go to that site. all of the stuff about kurt is closer to the middle ,so youd have to slide down the page.
--amber

The figure given to them could easily have been misreported. The only evidence of this figure is the paper report. Papers get it wrong. And to my knowledge, it IS illegal in that state for it to be released.

But when you're suicidal, you aren't thinking straight. That's the point.

Which could alternately mean, he was going to kill himself so he didn't want Courtney finding him to stop him.

You need to stop trying to guess why they were with each other and how much or little they loved each other. You don't know either of them.